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	<title>Comments on: On Feminism and Transphobia</title>
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	<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/</link>
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		<title>By: In Which I Have Fucked Up &#171; Listen to Meeeee!</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-20384</link>
		<dc:creator>In Which I Have Fucked Up &#171; Listen to Meeeee!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Jan 2011 05:37:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-20384</guid>
		<description>[...] I&#8217;m re-examining what it means to call myself a feminist because, you know, there&#8217;s a lot of bullshit that goes on within the movement.  My comment wasn&#8217;t made in a vacuum and I [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I&#8217;m re-examining what it means to call myself a feminist because, you know, there&#8217;s a lot of bullshit that goes on within the movement.  My comment wasn&#8217;t made in a vacuum and I [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Take it to the bridge &#171; bird of paradox</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-6028</link>
		<dc:creator>Take it to the bridge &#171; bird of paradox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 21:40:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-6028</guid>
		<description>[...] On Feminism and Transphobia - The Curvature (Cara) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] On Feminism and Transphobia &#8211; The Curvature (Cara) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: queerunity</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-6004</link>
		<dc:creator>queerunity</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 20:58:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-6004</guid>
		<description>thanks for standing up for trans people!

happy pride!
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.queersunited.blogspot.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.queersunited.blogspot.com&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thanks for standing up for trans people!</p>
<p>happy pride!<br />
<a href="http://www.queersunited.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.queersunited.blogspot.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: What if the Sunday papers included information like this? Links for June 23-28, 2008 &#171; Professor, What If&#8230;?</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-6002</link>
		<dc:creator>What if the Sunday papers included information like this? Links for June 23-28, 2008 &#171; Professor, What If&#8230;?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 18:40:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-6002</guid>
		<description>[...] Over at Counterpunch at the beginning of the week, Robert Fantina questioned McCain&#8217;s claim that the recent Supreme Court ruling that granted Gauntanamo prisoners the ability to seek redress in civilian courts is &#8220;&#8221;one of the worst decisions in the history of this country&#8221;. As his post, &#8220;McCain, Racism, and the Supreme Court,&#8221;  suggests, apparently giving prisoners habeas corpus rights is WORSE than the Dred Scott decision. Perhaps we should call him John McRasict.&#8220; [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Over at Counterpunch at the beginning of the week, Robert Fantina questioned McCain&#8217;s claim that the recent Supreme Court ruling that granted Gauntanamo prisoners the ability to seek redress in civilian courts is &#8220;&#8221;one of the worst decisions in the history of this country&#8221;. As his post, &#8220;McCain, Racism, and the Supreme Court,&#8221;  suggests, apparently giving prisoners habeas corpus rights is WORSE than the Dred Scott decision. Perhaps we should call him John McRasict.&#8220; [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Lisa Harney</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-6001</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa Harney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 09:38:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-6001</guid>
		<description>&quot;feels dehumanizing &lt;em&gt;and&lt;/em&gt; othering.&quot;

&quot;Trans woman&quot; tends to work better, as opposed to &quot;cis woman.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;feels dehumanizing <em>and</em> othering.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Trans woman&#8221; tends to work better, as opposed to &#8220;cis woman.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Lisa Harney</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-6000</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa Harney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 09:31:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-6000</guid>
		<description>I hate &quot;mtf,&quot; as it&#039;s more of an adjective describing a verb, and feels dehumanizing othering. I&#039;m a &lt;em&gt;woman&lt;/em&gt;, not an &lt;em&gt;mtf&lt;/em&gt;. &quot;MTF&quot; describes something I did in my past, but doesn&#039;t define my entire life, nor does it define the entirety of my womanhood. Seeing &quot;mtf&quot; and &quot;woman&quot; explicitly separated like that looks like language that clearly marks me as outside womanhood.

I&#039;m not saying you&#039;re saying that, just explaining what bothers me about the way the language reads to me. As to your actual point: That people like mAndrea rail about transgender and transsexual people because they make transgenderism and transsexualism all about them? Yes, I think that&#039;s a fair and accurate point. I don&#039;t think it should excuse them.

I&#039;m also not really sure that many of these women who complain about trans people reifying the gender binary really do all that much in the real world to act against the gender binary. Many are feminine, many are masculine. I don&#039;t think I&#039;ve really come across any who are trying to actively ungender the world. If anything, many are fairly quick to strongly and rigidly gender stuff and then decry it (sometimes even denigrating femininity in ways I would charitably describe as misogynist).

And, the fact is, if they want to attack anyone for reifying and reinforcing the gender binary and its boundaries, going after people who cross those boundaries, who define themselves anywhere from masculine to feminine, and male to female, despite their birth and assumed upbringing, makes less sense than going after the large majority of cisgender and cissexual people who actively police and reinforce the gender binary, most especially against those who are seen as violating the boundaries (gay, lesbian, bisexual, trans, queer, etc).

This comes down to:

1) Their own prejudices

2) Who&#039;s safest to attack</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hate &#8220;mtf,&#8221; as it&#8217;s more of an adjective describing a verb, and feels dehumanizing othering. I&#8217;m a <em>woman</em>, not an <em>mtf</em>. &#8220;MTF&#8221; describes something I did in my past, but doesn&#8217;t define my entire life, nor does it define the entirety of my womanhood. Seeing &#8220;mtf&#8221; and &#8220;woman&#8221; explicitly separated like that looks like language that clearly marks me as outside womanhood.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not saying you&#8217;re saying that, just explaining what bothers me about the way the language reads to me. As to your actual point: That people like mAndrea rail about transgender and transsexual people because they make transgenderism and transsexualism all about them? Yes, I think that&#8217;s a fair and accurate point. I don&#8217;t think it should excuse them.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m also not really sure that many of these women who complain about trans people reifying the gender binary really do all that much in the real world to act against the gender binary. Many are feminine, many are masculine. I don&#8217;t think I&#8217;ve really come across any who are trying to actively ungender the world. If anything, many are fairly quick to strongly and rigidly gender stuff and then decry it (sometimes even denigrating femininity in ways I would charitably describe as misogynist).</p>
<p>And, the fact is, if they want to attack anyone for reifying and reinforcing the gender binary and its boundaries, going after people who cross those boundaries, who define themselves anywhere from masculine to feminine, and male to female, despite their birth and assumed upbringing, makes less sense than going after the large majority of cisgender and cissexual people who actively police and reinforce the gender binary, most especially against those who are seen as violating the boundaries (gay, lesbian, bisexual, trans, queer, etc).</p>
<p>This comes down to:</p>
<p>1) Their own prejudices</p>
<p>2) Who&#8217;s safest to attack</p>
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		<title>By: brenna</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-5994</link>
		<dc:creator>brenna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Jun 2008 03:12:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-5994</guid>
		<description>Well.  Clearly, anyone who wants to become &quot;the other&quot; has an antiquated view of what gender is and is going to do nothing but reinforce gender stereotypes and keep me in a prison....

Seriously though.  The issue probably is that these women have fought for things that push the boundaries of gender roles, and they see people who want to change to a different and defined gender role as attacking that.  The scariest thing in the world for someone who sees themselves as unique and &quot;envelope pushing&quot; is for someone to decide to fit into a certain category.  They don&#039;t see it as &quot;I don&#039;t feel like the gender I was born/ascribed as fits who I am, they see &quot;I want to change genders so it will be socially acceptable for me to be a lumberjack/wear a pink feather boa every day (insensitive exaggerations purposeful to the illustration).

The reality is that gender is still such an inherently undermining and uncomfortable and anxiety-prone issue in the lives of so many that anything discussing it leaves us feeling vulnerable and attacked.  It has nothing to do with what an mtf might want to do with her life, but what another woman fears the mtf might expect from the other&#039;s femininity.  It&#039;s not about what the ftm feels about himself, it&#039;s what the woman fears he doesn&#039;t value about femininity.  It&#039;s not about the transgendered person.  It&#039;s about the insecurities of so many women who haven&#039;t figured out who they are and have defined themselves solely by how they can oppose the norm.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well.  Clearly, anyone who wants to become &#8220;the other&#8221; has an antiquated view of what gender is and is going to do nothing but reinforce gender stereotypes and keep me in a prison&#8230;.</p>
<p>Seriously though.  The issue probably is that these women have fought for things that push the boundaries of gender roles, and they see people who want to change to a different and defined gender role as attacking that.  The scariest thing in the world for someone who sees themselves as unique and &#8220;envelope pushing&#8221; is for someone to decide to fit into a certain category.  They don&#8217;t see it as &#8220;I don&#8217;t feel like the gender I was born/ascribed as fits who I am, they see &#8220;I want to change genders so it will be socially acceptable for me to be a lumberjack/wear a pink feather boa every day (insensitive exaggerations purposeful to the illustration).</p>
<p>The reality is that gender is still such an inherently undermining and uncomfortable and anxiety-prone issue in the lives of so many that anything discussing it leaves us feeling vulnerable and attacked.  It has nothing to do with what an mtf might want to do with her life, but what another woman fears the mtf might expect from the other&#8217;s femininity.  It&#8217;s not about what the ftm feels about himself, it&#8217;s what the woman fears he doesn&#8217;t value about femininity.  It&#8217;s not about the transgendered person.  It&#8217;s about the insecurities of so many women who haven&#8217;t figured out who they are and have defined themselves solely by how they can oppose the norm.</p>
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		<title>By: Renee</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-5965</link>
		<dc:creator>Renee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jun 2008 01:02:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-5965</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;I don’t feel that incidents of bigotry within a movement are reason enough to reject that movements politics or name. But we sure the hell should talk about it and express why it isn’t right.&lt;/em&gt;

I don&#039;t know if that is always so easy. I identify as a womanist strictly because of the racism in feminism. I refuse to turn my back on feminism but cannot identify with a label that has historically treated people like me as other. I think at this time feminism has much to prove to the people that it has alienated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>I don’t feel that incidents of bigotry within a movement are reason enough to reject that movements politics or name. But we sure the hell should talk about it and express why it isn’t right.</em></p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know if that is always so easy. I identify as a womanist strictly because of the racism in feminism. I refuse to turn my back on feminism but cannot identify with a label that has historically treated people like me as other. I think at this time feminism has much to prove to the people that it has alienated.</p>
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		<title>By: Lisa Harney</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-5949</link>
		<dc:creator>Lisa Harney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 05:27:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-5949</guid>
		<description>The problem I have with many of the more militantly vocal advocates of &quot;gender as a social construction&quot; (like mAndrea in the post quoted above) is that they take &quot;social construct&quot; to equal &quot;imaginary,&quot; and then try to use that to prove that being trans isn&#039;t really possible.

Other popular social constructs include law, government, police, money, economics, corporations, marriage, family, property, territory, nations, entertainment, fidelity, morals, ethics, taxes, language, courtesy, and so on.

mAndrea hypocritically decides that this one social construct is unacceptable and that trans people are primarily guilty for upholding a pervasive construct that is largely enforced by people who are not themselves trans. She&#039;s attacking trans people who actually have the least amount of power when it comes to dealing with gender normativity, and are typically subjected heavily to it in order to receive treatment.

Of course, by railing against trans people, mAndrea herself is trying to reinforce gender norms, demanding that those born male never cross to womanhood and those born female never cross to manhood. She knows as well as anyone else that there is no &quot;respectable third gender,&quot; and that thirdgendering is used to other people and treat them as subhuman (just as she does). She transgresses nothing, she simply sets out to reinforce the dominant paradigm.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem I have with many of the more militantly vocal advocates of &#8220;gender as a social construction&#8221; (like mAndrea in the post quoted above) is that they take &#8220;social construct&#8221; to equal &#8220;imaginary,&#8221; and then try to use that to prove that being trans isn&#8217;t really possible.</p>
<p>Other popular social constructs include law, government, police, money, economics, corporations, marriage, family, property, territory, nations, entertainment, fidelity, morals, ethics, taxes, language, courtesy, and so on.</p>
<p>mAndrea hypocritically decides that this one social construct is unacceptable and that trans people are primarily guilty for upholding a pervasive construct that is largely enforced by people who are not themselves trans. She&#8217;s attacking trans people who actually have the least amount of power when it comes to dealing with gender normativity, and are typically subjected heavily to it in order to receive treatment.</p>
<p>Of course, by railing against trans people, mAndrea herself is trying to reinforce gender norms, demanding that those born male never cross to womanhood and those born female never cross to manhood. She knows as well as anyone else that there is no &#8220;respectable third gender,&#8221; and that thirdgendering is used to other people and treat them as subhuman (just as she does). She transgresses nothing, she simply sets out to reinforce the dominant paradigm.</p>
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		<title>By: Prophet King Governance Press &#187; links for 2008-06-27</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2008/06/25/on-feminism-and-transphobia/#comment-5947</link>
		<dc:creator>Prophet King Governance Press &#187; links for 2008-06-27</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 04:35:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=808#comment-5947</guid>
		<description>[...] On Feminism and Transphobia : The Curvature I’m not linking to it, but it’s the very last post in the carnival, and unless you’re also an anti-trans bigot or merely ignorant about trans issues, a title like “Deconstructing Transgenderism” will probably stick out at you like a sore thumb. (tags: gender feminism sexuality bias) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] On Feminism and Transphobia : The Curvature I’m not linking to it, but it’s the very last post in the carnival, and unless you’re also an anti-trans bigot or merely ignorant about trans issues, a title like “Deconstructing Transgenderism” will probably stick out at you like a sore thumb. (tags: gender feminism sexuality bias) [...]</p>
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