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	<title>Comments on: Equality and Justice for Whom?</title>
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		<title>By: Hypatia</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12490</link>
		<dc:creator>Hypatia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 May 2009 11:31:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12490</guid>
		<description>This is a wonderful post; very thorough and elegant. I have nothing to add, except to let you know that there are a lot of cis gays (married ones, even!) who feel the same about this as you do. My partner and I are two of them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a wonderful post; very thorough and elegant. I have nothing to add, except to let you know that there are a lot of cis gays (married ones, even!) who feel the same about this as you do. My partner and I are two of them.</p>
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		<title>By: Just a reminder about GENDA &#171; Questioning Transphobia</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12460</link>
		<dc:creator>Just a reminder about GENDA &#171; Questioning Transphobia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 May 2009 17:43:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12460</guid>
		<description>[...] h/t The Curvature [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] h/t The Curvature [...]</p>
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		<title>By: GallingGalla</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12385</link>
		<dc:creator>GallingGalla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 01:57:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12385</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;if *waving* is code for something, I don’t know what it is&lt;/i&gt;

nope, not a code. just another way of saying &quot;hi&quot; :o)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>if *waving* is code for something, I don’t know what it is</i></p>
<p>nope, not a code. just another way of saying &#8220;hi&#8221; :o)</p>
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		<title>By: Cara</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12372</link>
		<dc:creator>Cara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 13:13:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12372</guid>
		<description>*waves back at gg* (No seriously, if *waving* is code for something, I don&#039;t know what it is. :/  But if you&#039;re just waving . . . hi, and it&#039;s good to see you!)

I agree with GallingGalla that I will believe it if/when I see it.  I will also go a step further to say that I think that even if it is true, public, vocal support is also extremely important, especially in such a gathering.  There were a lot of trans people who attended that day.  I imagine, that since it was supposed to be a vocal, unabashed day of support, that it would have been important to them to see their issues represented, rather than being simply told &quot;oh, it&#039;s behind the scenes.&quot;  The day was about &lt;i&gt;stepping out from behind the scenes and getting people involved&lt;/i&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>*waves back at gg* (No seriously, if *waving* is code for something, I don&#8217;t know what it is. :/  But if you&#8217;re just waving . . . hi, and it&#8217;s good to see you!)</p>
<p>I agree with GallingGalla that I will believe it if/when I see it.  I will also go a step further to say that I think that even if it is true, public, vocal support is also extremely important, especially in such a gathering.  There were a lot of trans people who attended that day.  I imagine, that since it was supposed to be a vocal, unabashed day of support, that it would have been important to them to see their issues represented, rather than being simply told &#8220;oh, it&#8217;s behind the scenes.&#8221;  The day was about <i>stepping out from behind the scenes and getting people involved</i>.</p>
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		<title>By: GallingGalla</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12364</link>
		<dc:creator>GallingGalla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 May 2009 04:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12364</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;But I also noticed something throughout the day that, while I may not be in the best position to do so as a straight and cis person, seemed to me to deserve a strong critique.&lt;/i&gt;

but it&#039;s good that you did notice and critique it.  better than silence.  which is what we get from (most) cis lgb groups.

oh, and caprice?  i&#039;ll believe it when i see it.  when GENDA is passed and signed by the governor, (maybe) i&#039;ll believe your words.  until that happens, your words are just a tone argument.

(p.s. *gg waves at cara*)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>But I also noticed something throughout the day that, while I may not be in the best position to do so as a straight and cis person, seemed to me to deserve a strong critique.</i></p>
<p>but it&#8217;s good that you did notice and critique it.  better than silence.  which is what we get from (most) cis lgb groups.</p>
<p>oh, and caprice?  i&#8217;ll believe it when i see it.  when GENDA is passed and signed by the governor, (maybe) i&#8217;ll believe your words.  until that happens, your words are just a tone argument.</p>
<p>(p.s. *gg waves at cara*)</p>
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		<title>By: caprice bellefleur</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12345</link>
		<dc:creator>caprice bellefleur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 04:01:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12345</guid>
		<description>The writer&#039;s observations were basically correct, IMO. And though she says she doesn&#039;t want to judge the Pride Agenda on its apparently unequal treatment of GENDA, it&#039;s pretty clear what she thinks. But I think she&#039;s wrong. 

The Pride Agenda&#039;s behind-the-scenes lobbying on behalf of GENDA is very strong. As a member of the steering committee of the GENDA Coalition, I have seen how much effort and resources the Pride Agenda has devoted to our cause. And their present efforts have not diminished one bit, despite the increase in the public attention to marriage equality that the governor&#039;s actions and out-of-state events have generated--things totally out of the Pride Agenda&#039;s control.

The Pride Agenda certainly cannot tell the governor what to say, even to a Pride Agenda gathering. He sets his own agenda. Nor does it really have that much control over what the speakers they select for the rally say. I&#039;m sure suggestions can be made, but I doubt they know exactly what will be said in advance. As for the trans woman who spoke at the rally, I agree that she was disappointing. I have met with her in the past, and she is quite effective when talking to 3 people--but to 2,000 is another matter. (The choice of the trans speaker for the rally has been a difficult one for the Pride Agenda. They came under a fair amount of criticism for the series of white, middle-aged ones, the last one imported from out-of-state.) 

Where it really counts, the Pride Agenda has been working for GENDA tirelessly. They know that it has more votes and a better chance to pass than marriage equality. The campaign for GENDA will be becoming more public in the next week or so, and it will be quite evident that the Pride Agenda is fully committed to getting GENDA enacted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The writer&#8217;s observations were basically correct, IMO. And though she says she doesn&#8217;t want to judge the Pride Agenda on its apparently unequal treatment of GENDA, it&#8217;s pretty clear what she thinks. But I think she&#8217;s wrong. </p>
<p>The Pride Agenda&#8217;s behind-the-scenes lobbying on behalf of GENDA is very strong. As a member of the steering committee of the GENDA Coalition, I have seen how much effort and resources the Pride Agenda has devoted to our cause. And their present efforts have not diminished one bit, despite the increase in the public attention to marriage equality that the governor&#8217;s actions and out-of-state events have generated&#8211;things totally out of the Pride Agenda&#8217;s control.</p>
<p>The Pride Agenda certainly cannot tell the governor what to say, even to a Pride Agenda gathering. He sets his own agenda. Nor does it really have that much control over what the speakers they select for the rally say. I&#8217;m sure suggestions can be made, but I doubt they know exactly what will be said in advance. As for the trans woman who spoke at the rally, I agree that she was disappointing. I have met with her in the past, and she is quite effective when talking to 3 people&#8211;but to 2,000 is another matter. (The choice of the trans speaker for the rally has been a difficult one for the Pride Agenda. They came under a fair amount of criticism for the series of white, middle-aged ones, the last one imported from out-of-state.) </p>
<p>Where it really counts, the Pride Agenda has been working for GENDA tirelessly. They know that it has more votes and a better chance to pass than marriage equality. The campaign for GENDA will be becoming more public in the next week or so, and it will be quite evident that the Pride Agenda is fully committed to getting GENDA enacted.</p>
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		<title>By: Emelye Waldherr</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12324</link>
		<dc:creator>Emelye Waldherr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 May 2009 23:32:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12324</guid>
		<description>Hazumu may be right in thinking humans need scapegoats and groups to despise but aren&#039;t there enough of them, without adding trans people, to use up the hate?  I mean, there are more than enough groups that deserve our disapprobation?  Aren&#039;t drug dealers and pedophiles and wife abusers and serial killers, etc, enough?

I guess they would be if trans people were not considered heinous enough to be mentioned in the same breath as those groups.  We still have a very long way to go in terms of education, I guess.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hazumu may be right in thinking humans need scapegoats and groups to despise but aren&#8217;t there enough of them, without adding trans people, to use up the hate?  I mean, there are more than enough groups that deserve our disapprobation?  Aren&#8217;t drug dealers and pedophiles and wife abusers and serial killers, etc, enough?</p>
<p>I guess they would be if trans people were not considered heinous enough to be mentioned in the same breath as those groups.  We still have a very long way to go in terms of education, I guess.</p>
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		<title>By: Hazumu Osaragi</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12317</link>
		<dc:creator>Hazumu Osaragi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 May 2009 21:02:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12317</guid>
		<description>It appears there is a desperate need for a scapegoat in society.  Normal-appearing gays and lesbians have managed to begin moving into the mainstream, but the need still remains.

&#039;Trannies&#039; still have that &quot;ikk&quot; cachet, so we (as a society) still have someone to choose against.  It&#039;s like the line in &quot;Blazing Saddles&quot; where the townspeople need help, and get an offer from a diverse group of non-white-non-protestant &#039;undesirables&#039;, the catch being that the white-protestant townspeople have to let them live amongst them after the aid is rendered.  Finally, the spokesman says, &quot;All right... we&#039;ll give some land to the n*****s and the c****s. But we don&#039;t want the Irish!&quot;.

Same story.  Some group has to be made into the losers.  As the straight-normal-appearing gays and lesbians walk into the light, there is a concerted campaign to paint the transgenders as uber-icky.  We trans seem to be receiving the revulsiveness that gays and lesbians are finally managing to shed.

As there seems to be a need for someone to be untouchable caste and to carry away an imagined stench from the rest of society, might we quietly invest in some sort of social programs to provide humane support and a modicum of dignity to trans persons while we serve the societal purpose of being the ones it&#039;s okay to reject and deny membership in society to?

Just a thought...

Hazumu the SmartA**</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It appears there is a desperate need for a scapegoat in society.  Normal-appearing gays and lesbians have managed to begin moving into the mainstream, but the need still remains.</p>
<p>&#8216;Trannies&#8217; still have that &#8220;ikk&#8221; cachet, so we (as a society) still have someone to choose against.  It&#8217;s like the line in &#8220;Blazing Saddles&#8221; where the townspeople need help, and get an offer from a diverse group of non-white-non-protestant &#8216;undesirables&#8217;, the catch being that the white-protestant townspeople have to let them live amongst them after the aid is rendered.  Finally, the spokesman says, &#8220;All right&#8230; we&#8217;ll give some land to the n*****s and the c****s. But we don&#8217;t want the Irish!&#8221;.</p>
<p>Same story.  Some group has to be made into the losers.  As the straight-normal-appearing gays and lesbians walk into the light, there is a concerted campaign to paint the transgenders as uber-icky.  We trans seem to be receiving the revulsiveness that gays and lesbians are finally managing to shed.</p>
<p>As there seems to be a need for someone to be untouchable caste and to carry away an imagined stench from the rest of society, might we quietly invest in some sort of social programs to provide humane support and a modicum of dignity to trans persons while we serve the societal purpose of being the ones it&#8217;s okay to reject and deny membership in society to?</p>
<p>Just a thought&#8230;</p>
<p>Hazumu the SmartA**</p>
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		<title>By: FrustratedinCT</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12302</link>
		<dc:creator>FrustratedinCT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 May 2009 20:45:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12302</guid>
		<description>The same thing happen here Connecticut, last October the Supreme Court ruled in favor of marriage equality and same-sex marriage became legal.

We were promised that the gender identity bill would have #1 priority. That this was our year!
However, a bill to codify the marriage ruling was raised first in committee, had a hearing first and was voted out of committee first. Time then ran out and the gender identity bill never made it out of committee.

Once again, we were screwed by the LGB community.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The same thing happen here Connecticut, last October the Supreme Court ruled in favor of marriage equality and same-sex marriage became legal.</p>
<p>We were promised that the gender identity bill would have #1 priority. That this was our year!<br />
However, a bill to codify the marriage ruling was raised first in committee, had a hearing first and was voted out of committee first. Time then ran out and the gender identity bill never made it out of committee.</p>
<p>Once again, we were screwed by the LGB community.</p>
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		<title>By: Emelye Waldherr</title>
		<link>http://thecurvature.com/2009/05/07/equality-and-justice-for-whom/#comment-12297</link>
		<dc:creator>Emelye Waldherr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 May 2009 15:59:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thecurvature.com/?p=5176#comment-12297</guid>
		<description>What happened on E&amp;J Day regarding the shift to the fore of marriage equality over GENDA was what I feared when I heard Gov. Patterson announce the introduction of the marriage equality bill.  It dismayed me to no end because I knew that trans people would once again be pushed into the background by the GLB community.  

I was fortunate that my facilitator was another trans woman so we did get GENDA into our discussion with our senator&#039;s aide but I agree, the general tome of the whole day was for marriage, them DASA and GENDA.  Because of this I&#039;ve decided to act unilaterally, to write to the senate&#039;s Investigations and Operations committee members, where their version of GENDA has been sitting since February, in support of both bills but emphasizing the critical necessity of GENDA over marriage equality.  The member&#039;s email addresses are: 

johnson@senate.state.ny.us, 
diaz@senate.state.ny.us, 
espada@senate.state.ny.us, golden@senate.state.ny.us, 
klein@senate.state.ny.us,
nozzolio@senate.state.ny.us,
stachows@senate.state.ny.us,
winner@senate.state.ny.us 

I told them that marriage equality is very important and that GENDA is vital.  I told them,

&quot;The ability to marry a same sex sweetheart is pretty worthless if you can&#039;t get a job no matter what your qualifications are or if your landlord has thrown you out of your home because he doesn&#039;t &quot;rent to your kind.&quot;  Being married to a person of the same sex doesn&#039;t help when a bouncer throws you out of a bathroom or restaurant because some paranoid and ignorant customer made a complaint about your appearance rather than behavior.&quot;

Please take some time to write them as well.  If we cannot rely on the GLB community then we must do the best we can to shift for ourselves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What happened on E&amp;J Day regarding the shift to the fore of marriage equality over GENDA was what I feared when I heard Gov. Patterson announce the introduction of the marriage equality bill.  It dismayed me to no end because I knew that trans people would once again be pushed into the background by the GLB community.  </p>
<p>I was fortunate that my facilitator was another trans woman so we did get GENDA into our discussion with our senator&#8217;s aide but I agree, the general tome of the whole day was for marriage, them DASA and GENDA.  Because of this I&#8217;ve decided to act unilaterally, to write to the senate&#8217;s Investigations and Operations committee members, where their version of GENDA has been sitting since February, in support of both bills but emphasizing the critical necessity of GENDA over marriage equality.  The member&#8217;s email addresses are: </p>
<p><a href="mailto:johnson@senate.state.ny.us">johnson@senate.state.ny.us</a>,<br />
<a href="mailto:diaz@senate.state.ny.us">diaz@senate.state.ny.us</a>,<br />
<a href="mailto:espada@senate.state.ny.us">espada@senate.state.ny.us</a>, <a href="mailto:golden@senate.state.ny.us">golden@senate.state.ny.us</a>,<br />
<a href="mailto:klein@senate.state.ny.us">klein@senate.state.ny.us</a>,<br />
<a href="mailto:nozzolio@senate.state.ny.us">nozzolio@senate.state.ny.us</a>,<br />
<a href="mailto:stachows@senate.state.ny.us">stachows@senate.state.ny.us</a>,<br />
<a href="mailto:winner@senate.state.ny.us">winner@senate.state.ny.us</a> </p>
<p>I told them that marriage equality is very important and that GENDA is vital.  I told them,</p>
<p>&#8220;The ability to marry a same sex sweetheart is pretty worthless if you can&#8217;t get a job no matter what your qualifications are or if your landlord has thrown you out of your home because he doesn&#8217;t &#8220;rent to your kind.&#8221;  Being married to a person of the same sex doesn&#8217;t help when a bouncer throws you out of a bathroom or restaurant because some paranoid and ignorant customer made a complaint about your appearance rather than behavior.&#8221;</p>
<p>Please take some time to write them as well.  If we cannot rely on the GLB community then we must do the best we can to shift for ourselves.</p>
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